When Ellen and I were first married ministry was not our 20-year plan, the Navy was. We had it all planned out; we were to spend the next 20 years with me being gone for 15. The Navy explained to my sweet new bride how grueling it would be, that I would be gone often and that even when I was around my mind would be elsewhere. Knowing that my particular career path in the Navy would be a marriage destroyer I pursued a discharge for the pursuit of higher education. With the promise of a difficult future behind us we embarked upon an easier dream where everyone would love us and things would be calm: pastoral service.
Twenty plus years later I can tell you it has been a ride we never could have anticipated. So much so that only now do I feel equipped enough to share a few things I either lacked the clarity or courage to share until this season of life. I want to share the 10 things we as pastors don’t really want you to know about us. Now in doing so my aim is not to rat out my fellow pastors. Nor am I doing this so congregants sleep with one eye open regarding their leadership. My intention is precisely the opposite. I hope that from this:
- Churches will pray all the more for their pastors because they understand the challenges.
- Churches will be doubly grateful for the fact that so many pastors stay in the saddle despite their fears, hurts and frustrations.
- People in churches will think twice before engaging in things that sink deep into the soul of their leaders.
Therefore I give a glimpse into what we as pastors don’t like to admit about ourselves.
#1. We Take It Personally When You Leave The Church.
It’s just a straight up fact. We pastors eat, drink and sleep the local church and with that have a deep desires to see it thrive. Therefore when you leave to another church because…
- you’re bothered by a recent decision, but didn’t ask about it…
- the new church has a bigger and better kids wing, youth group, worship team, building space, (fill in your blank)…
- your friends started going there…
… it hits us personally.
For us it feels disloyal, shallow or consumer driven. People affirm that church is a family, thus when you up and leave because the church down the road has Slurpee dispensers, a fog machine or it’s just cooler, well it jams us pretty deep.
#2. We Feel Pressure To Perform Week After Week.
The average TV show has a multimillion-dollar budget, a staff of writers and only airs 22 weeks out of the year; that’s what we feel we’re up against. Where the pressure is doubled comes from the previous point. We know there are churches near by with a multimillion-dollar budget or a celebrity pastor who have the ability to do many more things at a much higher level. From this a sense of urgency is created in our mind to establish the same level of quality, option and excellence to meet the consumerist desires of culture.
Now if this were exclusively in the hopes of reaching new people this wouldn’t be so bad, but increasingly pastors feel the need to do this just to retain people who may be stuff struck by the “Bigger and Better” down the way.
#3. We Struggle With Getting Our Worth From Ministry.
When the numbers are up, the complements are flowing and the people are lively we feel great. When everything is level, it feels like it’s in decline. When things are actually in decline, it’s a full-tilt tailspin in our soul. We almost can’t help but equate the growth of the church with our ability/inability to produce growth. Therefore if there is any appearance of waning we feel defeated and wonder how long before the church board wises up and trades us to another team. The “Idol of Ministry” comes on and off the shelf pretty regularly in a pastor’s office.
#4. We Regularly Think About Quitting.
This comes in two very different forms.
One form is the variation of perhaps leaving ministry all together. While there are some really great things about vocational ministry, there are also less enjoyable realities such as: pastors’ families are noticed (i.e. judged) routinely, pastors’ purchases are observed (i.e. judged) overtly and pastors’ words are weighed (i.e. judged) consistently. Therefore the ability to hide among the masses and not be noticed is very appealing.
The second form comes with the desire for a change of scenery. Pastors are shepherds, thus we love greener grass even more than sheep. To leave for a bigger budget, better building or a place with less difficult people (yeah, we get delusional sometimes) stands out as lush Kentucky Bluegrass when contrasted with the dusty patch of ragged earth called “our current church.” This “Greener Grass Gawking” usually occurs when we become too proud (“My gifts are better than this place”) or too insecure (“I stink and just need to start over”) and flows from #3.
#5. We Say We Are Transparent – It’s Actually Opaque.
Today pastors are generally more open about their struggles than previous generations, but we still sense there is a threshold that is not to be crossed. People want open, honest and real, but not too much. Generally churches want just enough so they feel safe with you, but not so much that it spoils the expectations they have of you. Unfortunately the threshold is a blurry line by which pastors never know how much is too much until its too late. After a couple of infractions we learn that opaque is safe – even if it’s isolating.
When pastors’ wives are polled on how it feels to be the spouse of someone in full-time ministry the #1 answer is one profound word, “Lonely.” They are around hundreds of people every week, but they never feel they can let their guard down because they know people have opinions on how a pastor’s wife should be. Now I know people say they don’t, but literally every church I have served in has shared unflattering stories of the previous pastor’s wife. Many of these stories came from the spiritually mature leadership who considered the pastor and his wife to be their friends. The real irony comes in when later in the conversation I would be told, “But don’t worry, we don’t have any expectations on your wife. We just want to love on her.” Right! Now I don’t blame people for this natural human tendency, but being aware of how things are keeps you relationally opaque. And it’s not merely pastors and their wives who insulate. Pastoral families at large feel alone because there is a certain level of unknown expectations buried like landmines through the field of the church and so there is a constant mode of mostly transparent.
#6. We Measure Ourselves By The Numbers.
Numbers don’t matter! Yeah right. No matter how badly we want to slap that bumper sticker on our Ford the reality is that numbers matter to us. And they matter to us it part because they matter to God. The problem however goes back to #1-3. The absence of growth in our churches can cascade into an internal turmoil by which we begin to scrounge for “The Next Big Thing” that will bring “Radical Growth” “Guaranteed.” So we read books on how to be a “Deep & Wide, Vertical, Purpose Driven, Radical Reformission, Creature of the Word, Big Idea, Center Church.” Then we jet off to a conference with thousands of other pastors who are seeking to glean the secret of success. And what is the first question we ask one another between sessions? “So, how big is your church?” Yep, we measure ourselves by the numbers.
#7 We Spend More Time Discouraged Than Encouraged.
Occasionally people say to me, “Must be awesome to get paid to study the Bible all day.” Every time they do I think to myself, “Must be awesome to be able to give someone the finger on the 520 without people saying, ‘The pastor at Redemption Church flipped me off today during rush-hour.’” I’m not fully sure why that is the comment that flashes across my mental dashboard, but I think part of it stems from what I perceive to be the tone of the comment. Rightly or wrongly I infer they are saying, “Must be nice to have such a cush gig as a paid quiet-time.” In all honestly it is pretty awesome to be paid study the Bible, but it’s a major downer when people:
- tell you – after 2 minutes of un-investigated reflection – that your 30 hours of study and 2 collegiate degrees were wrong.
- tell you that they just couldn’t stay awake today during your sermon, but no offense. (How about I fall asleep at your kid’s graduation and we’ll call it even.)
- tell you how you should have also said…
- tell you how Pastor So-N-So says…
Aside from these particular examples I find that for most pastors it generally feels like the boat is taking on water more than racing with the wind – regardless of size or rate of growth. Lead pastors particularly suffer from this since much of their job is to focus on seeing things get better, which often translates into focusing on the broken, lacking or unfilled parts of the church more than enjoying what is right and working. Many of the most faithful and fruitful pastors in history have suffered deeply with anxiety and depression for the same reasons.
#8. We Worry About What You Think.
We’re human and we want to be liked. Therefore when we know we’re going to do or say something people won’t like, we worry about it. Now when I say that I don’t mean to infer that it causes us to avoid the hard things. There are some of my fellow pastors who avoid challenging topics or decisions out of fear of people, but most of the ones I run with still choose deliver the mail regardless of the popularity of its message. Yet we still worry about how you may take it.
#9. We Struggle With Competition And Jealousy.
We like to hold ourselves above the petty fray and reiterate, “It’s all about the Kingdom,” but in reality pastors are a competitive bunch. As soon as one pastor asks another, “How big is your church?” the game is on if the two churches are within 20 miles of each other (past 20 miles we lighten up a lot and think each other is pretty cool). Within 20 miles however we begin to assess one another’s style, focus, message, sophistication and marketing. We gauge to see if it’s a “Goldilocks Church” – not to deep, not too shallow, but just right (like us). If you’re too deep we benchmark you as internally focused. If you’re too shallow we brand you as consumer-driven. If however we conclude that you too are a “Goldilocks Church” we then figure out how our church is still better than your church. If you have lame amenities, we critique that you will never grow until you reboot that 70’s sanctuary. If you have awesome amenities, we criticize that you grow only because people are shallow and care more about stuff than Scripture.
Yes we know it’s not right. We know that it’s ego driven, but we still fall victim to it. We believe our church is the best church ever and we can’t understand why everyone doesn’t see it.
#10. We Feel Like We Failed You More Than We Helped You.
Most pastors will never be famous. Most churches will never break the 100 mark. Yet we all entered ministry to change the world and reach the masses. With this we know it is the expectation of churches that we accomplish this very thing. Every job posting reinforces the idea with the sentence, “We are looking for a man that will take our church to the next level.” Then when the next level isn’t hit in the way anticipated or within the timeline envisioned – we feel like we failed you. This is especially true in light of the reality that we are our own biggest critics. We came in with expectations higher than anyone in the church. You look to us for direction and when we feel like we failed to produce we feel like we failed you.
The Everyday Missionary 
A and B. A: I agree across the board with the struggle and want to apologize for the people who “picked up offense” or want to “fix” you with some cliche. For whatever reason most people find it impossible to offer or attempt empathy with pastors. They just can’t imagine the burden we carry for sick people, divorces, death, “salvation,” authentic transformation, etc. That said, thanks for breaking the ice so that people can at least start to try. B: an interesting future article could probably be how we [as pastors] judge the congregation. There is no denying we sometimes sit down and see them as greedy, selfish, cowardly, gossiping, and dangerous little weasels. It’s not true, nor is it true that we have any right to sit in that place. But because we are assigned silence in these areas we rarely actually process it out into lamentation and then benediction. This additional component perhaps is the bookend to this article as it at least slows down burnout and offers a model for how we are escaping the darkness. Driscoll once wrote something like this “the offering today was 22.50 … and I want to buy bullets.” And we have probably all been there. Are the bullets for us or them? Who knows…but how do we get out of that place when we get there? And what can the church family do to help? Now that is a question.
I am newer in the ministry, having recently planted a campus for a multi-site church in 2013. We are doing well, but already I can identify with many of the well-written points. I was shocked, then, to read through the comments and find negative remarks from “holier than thou” people, most of whom have not walked in our shoes. They are simply proving the points in your brilliant article. Thank you for writing it.
Here is a thoughtful counter argument I found:
http://www.apologeticsindex.org/3026-complaining-pastors
Chad, I read both articles and I don’t believe PastorBoz was complaining at all. If anything, I think he was bring to light areas that the people of God need to know about their Pastor or Pastors.
Having worked a secular job recently and working full time in ministry I do not agree with the article which you cited. My secular job was quite stressful, long shifts (16-24 hours), difficult patients and families and losing a coworker in a Line-of-duty death. I would call EMS stressful, however when I went home I could turn it off.
If I needed to shut my phone off I was able to do so. For me it is not the midnight phone calls that upsets me, rather the potential for them is draining. When I was working a secular job I could go home and unwind but in ministry that is different. When I go home I think about the church, I worry about people, I wait for a phone call and my phone must always stay with me, fully charged and ready to be answered. This is not the case in many secular jobs.
I can tell you that my family was also never judged as harshly or hurt fully in the secular world.
Have I considered returning to my old way of life, absolutely. Will I? No.
I totally agree that it is the potential for the midnight calls that is so draining! That not being able to turn it off was a huge part of my getting burned out at child protective services. I could only feel free when I was in a another state, I guess pastors don’t even get that much relief.
Good article.
Hi Chad, thank you for posting this “thoughtful counter argument,” it’s excellent, and I will pass it on. I had reservations after reading this “10 THINGS PASTORS HATE TO ADMIT PUBLICLY,” by Pastorboz, and mainly because I don’t think it’s the best idea for him to speak for Pastors other than himself, as he stated “Therefore I give a glimpse into what we as pastors don’t like to admit about ourselves.” Clearly this can’t be the perspective of all pastors. For example, I can only imagine what a counter to this article would have been like from the late Leonard Ravenhill :o). Hopefully others will read the article you linked, and I’m saying that in hopes that it will just produce more thought on the topic, which will hopefully be a good thing. Again, I don’t think Pastorboz intent was wrong in writing this article, I only think it needed to be stated as his thoughts, not other pastors included.
Confession #11
We hate writing blogs about being transparent in fear of getting blasted by people in the comments. But we do it anyway. And it happens anyway.
*Keep on trucking bro. It aint easy but its worth it.
My husband has been blasted several times each place for being too “friendly, let you hair down, or whatever. It’s hard to keep a balance when he desires to have friends. I have always found friends outside the church until this rural one.
My dad was a pastor. My late husband was a pastor. My present husband-a pastor. You hit the nail on the head, all ten points.
And the toughest thing Jennifer is that what I find is that most pastors don’t confide these things to their friends, fellow pastors, boards and certainly not on a blog, but only to their poor sweet wives. You pastors wives carry the biggest burdens of all at times – us. Thank you!
Definitely. Also, in our newer church plant, my wife and 3 teen children often bat cleanup — working faithfully in children’s ministry because our volunteer bench isn’t deep, and helping me clean the church on Saturday if one of our volunteers cancel, etc etc. It’s a family effort.
We don’t share with other Pastors because I have learned they can’t be trusted due to point # 9. I shared with our DOM, once, only to have another Pastor brought in to our discussion and within 2 weeks he replaced me as interim. I have spent 25 years in ministry doing everything from Music, Youth, and Pastorate. In every church, save one, My family and were treated light outsiders and scum. I am no longer serving in the form of ministry and have no idea if our loving Lord will ever call me back into it.
It surprised me to see so many “my church” and “your church” in this confession. I thought it was Christ’s Church, and we merely the stewards. He is the One who births it and makes it grow and prosper. So relax and let the Shepperd lead. Big or small.
You must have been reading a different blog… there is not s single occurrence of “my church” or “your church” in the entire post. Aside from this pastors know it’s Jesus Church and still have struggles. For example, we know our kids are Jesus kids and we still worry, fret, get heart broken and the like.
The only occurrence of “your church” was in asking other pastors about the church they minister at. You definitely used “our church” not “my church”. I see this as an example of why you’d rather not talk about these things. Every word is scrutinized so much. How else would we communicate which church congregation we are talking about. Perhaps each time you should say “God’s Church at which I pastor” or “At which of God’s churches do you pastor”? Even then there would be something else petty to explain 🙂
Please don’t sound so self righteous. We all know it is Christ’s Church.
AMEN!! The thinking is way off when the “my church mentality” sets in. Things are obviously being done in the flesh and the Holy Spirit is not the one directing.
Frank, the “my church mentality” is not found in the original blogpost. It is a projection of others who have responded to it telling us more about the reader than the author of the post.
Sounds like we need a “Thank a Pastor Day.” Who’s with me?
October is Pastor Appreciation Month. It has been happening for quite some time. I am thinking that the 2nd Sunday of the month is the Thank a pastor Day. I haven’t checked that fact, but that is what is in my memory.
In my last ministry, I was “freed to go find my next place to serve” in October . . . during
pastor appreciation month.
I am retired from a long and sometimes very hard, and most times at the end very rewarding ministry. I kept reminding myself and others that “sheep make sheep, not shepherds”. And if I was feeling feisty, I would ask: “what are YOU doing to grow the congregation?” Also, reminded myself that “I am not the church, and the church is not me”. (Self differentiation). It is hard! The churches who recognize that it is GOD’s church and THEY are building it WITH me, were the most successful in all ways.
Peggy Wallace
Preacher’s kid, preacher’s spouse… appreciated your insights although I thought one or 2 of them were a little more generalized than was perhaps warranted. Mostly I’d like to point out that some of our best men are not in fact men at all 😉 … nor are their spouses all “wives”.
🙂 Here! Here! My husband and I are both pastors! But I’m usually introduced as ‘the pastor’s wife’ 🙂 and he always as ‘the pastor’.
Reblogged this on a stranger in my own land and commented:
Something to think about. Pray for your spiritual leaders!
I think, after pastoring as many years as this old man has, I’d feel like I was doing something wrong if I did feel at least 3 of these on a regular basis and all ten at least once in a year 😉
“did NOT feel” was the intended comment. See I just publicly blew it AGAIN…
You mean Pastors get frustrated too! Wow! I had no idea!!
Heaven forbid we be honest about whats going on inside our heads.
As a wife of a Pastor, I wish the Pastor had a Pastor.
Oh, Debbie, I so agree with you! And I think pastors wish they had a pastor. My husband and I both co-pastor a church, and there are so many times I wish we had a pastor.
They do, if they are willing to accept him.
Reminds me of a comment I heard John M Talbot say recently. He’d go sing and minister at various churches. Later they’d sit together and each church came up with the same ideas to reach their community, BUT the various denomination refused to work together. If you as a pastor, want a pastor, set up your worship times so you can attend another church down the street. You don’t have to agree with all their doctrine to attend. Personally I learn knew things in the various denominations I’ve visited. And in the process two or three small churches can learn to work together on the bigger projects.
To all the folks who have wished for a pastor to the pastors: To sustain long tern ministry, you HAVE to be fed and cared for yourself. If you have a group of elders or deacons in your church who gather regularly to pray for you, that’s a great thing, but you also need collegial relationships. We pastors are accountable to our elders, deacons and congregations, but we also need prayer/accountability partners we can trust to meet and pray with regularly, to share concerns and joys. We must be intentional in seeking out opportunities to be fed.
I know I would have not survived this ten years in ministry had I not found a spiritual director and groups of pastors with whom to fellowship.
Randy and Charlie, it’s not the spiritual feeding/worship that I’m talking about. We have an agreement with our church that every so many Sundays, we get a Sunday off for our own spiritual feeding. What I’m talking about is who pastors a pastor when they are going through difficult times? For instance, last year I had a miscarriage and went through some depression, however we live in a small community and I really didn’t want everyone and their second cousin, twice removed to know that I lost a baby. Also, at that time my husband was going through a very difficult time with some of the church members. I didn’t even feel like I could tell my husband because he was under so much stress. I didn’t want to add to it. Or what if we are having issues in our marriage and need some wise counsel? Who do we go to? Those are just a couple examples, but there are many instances where we are dealing with something we can’t really share with congregational members, and then knowing how much stress pastors go through, we are hesitant to share with other pastors because we don’t want to add to their load. I hope that makes sense.
Annie, I hear you and ache for you. And it is from the desire to help you find a way through this pain that I share the followng:
I don’t know what options are available in your context. In my situation I am a pastor in a connectional denomination where we are not called but sent. More than 40 years ago someone had the wisdome to recognize that we pastors needed a pastor ourselves. In response to that realization our conference (the regional association of churches through which we are connected to one another) decided to hire a pastor with special training in counseling specifically for that purpose. Any pastor or member of a pastor’s family can call on this pastoral counselor totally free of charge. I can tell you that it has made a signficant difference in not only my ministry but also in my marriage and parenting.
You may not have as well defined of a connectional system as mine; but, even if you don’t, what would happen if a group of pastors in even a loosely defined association were to pledge themselves to mutual ministry and support in such a way that they created and funded such a position themselves? (Though it would be nice if the congregations were the ones to be so wise, you don’t need to depend on them to make it happen.) You could create a non-profit ministry that each pastor would pledge to contribute to, and from that ministry fund the salary of such a pastoral counselor.
That might sound impossible or like simply a hair-brained idea at first. But as I said it has actually worked for us, and with a little ingenuity I suspect it would work for others as well.
Gene, I don’t think that is a hair-brained idea at all. I think it is a good idea. Unfortunately, it isn’t practical in our area. There is only one other pastor in our county who is full-time, all others are bi-vocational and struggling financially (as are we). And in our church affiliation, there are only 6 pastors in our state who are full-time. To further complicate the financial matters, I just found out at our board meeting that we may not be getting our full salary this year as finances at the church are down right now. However, you have given me an idea or two which I will probably pursue. Thank you for your comment.
And as a “solo pastor” in a smaller church, I wish my wife had a pastor. I neither can nor ought to be that.
As a pastor of 40 years and married for 43, Amen to the wife needing a pastor.
This is exactly what is wrong with today’s church. Numbers??? That is what God is looking for?? The ABC’s of today’s modern church: Attendance, Building, and Cash, that is what they care about. Reading books on how to grow your church, how about read the word and trust The Lord on your attendance. Where in the bible does it talk about this big church?? Narrow is the gate, FEW enter; Parable of the Sower, 3 out of 4 hearts reject the word; numerous accounts referred to as remnant is saved. Not saying we should not be out soul winning, but with some motive to weigh our church attendance. Jealousy??? Are you kidding me. This is the cesspool of modern teaching, which is heart breaking. Pastors preach some wishy washy message, not to offend any one, to keep attendance. Where’s that on the list.
And yet, Greg, you begin this post by implying that you don’t want to hear this sort of message and how you’re offended by it.
I’m unsure what you mean…
Of course numbers of congregants is not the most important thing. And of course the pastors know that. The author was pointing out that pastors are ONLY HUMAN too, and yet so much more is often expected of them. Remember to pray for your church leadership because they also suffer from human frailty. How is that such a hard message to receive?
To quote an intelligent pastor, yes, numbers are important because every number represents a person, every person has a story, and ever story matters to God. Then God takes our mess, and if we are willing He will turn our mess into a message to reach some who are still in their own mess.
You must be an evangelist….lol….
Reblogged this on Cassiciacum.
Reblogged this on reylo: thoughts from the journey and commented:
vulnerability is tough
Great stuff! I reBlogged it on my site: http://iChilly.com
This makes me want to tell our pastor how much we love and appreciate him. What a tough job.
There is a huge assumption that underlies this whole conversation, and I think we would do well to look at it in light of the New Testament. The assumption is, as Frank Owen put it in 1981, “Chaos easily develops where no one is in charge; if the church is to be one flock, it needs one shepherd.” The outworking of this assumption means, as Ministry magazine asserted, “The local church pastor is key — absolutely central — to everything we are and do as a church.” But where does the NT reveal anything about the traditional view of “the pastor”? If you read Matthew through Revelation, where is the notion of one person leading the flock and giving sermons every week? It just isn’t there, is it? Paul said that the body was not one part but many; but the way church is usually done paints a picture where everything important rests on “the pastor,” not the body. If we focused on the 58 one-another’s in the NT, then the weight of ministry would not crush those in the ‘clergy.” Why do 70% of pastor’s wives affirm that the worst day of their marriage was their husband’s ordination service?
Agree John, doesnt anybody take time to think about why we have these problems. Must the insanity continue? Even businesses would check the process if they found problems with the product. Not the Church, NO ONE wants to ask the most important question. Does our idea of the modern pastor have biblical precedent????
HERE is the problem
Upton Sinclair said: “It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends upon his not understanding it”
Bing! We have a Winner.
all things shared in common.
I am a bi-vocational pastor. We have a small, grassroots congregation that serves in the community. However, both my wife and I also work full-time, in order to make it, so many if these issues you bring to light are magnified due to our lack of down-time and periods of rest.
I can appreciate your comments and I thank you for posting this. It helps to know that we don’t stand alone. I covet the prayers of my fellow laborers, as I will also keep you in my prayers. God bless you all.
I’m sorry I am calling you out on this, but it’s 2014…there are plenty of women pastors and therefore pastors husbands, etc. While it may be implied it would be nice to be acknowledged.
I think you just did a pretty good job of that yourself. ….
Thank you for your post with its honesty and insight. Several of the comments look helpful too.
I would observe, as one who also struggles with the contradictory expectations of congregation and calling, that one of the problems stems from a false equation of church work = God’s work.
Of course, the work we do with and through the church should be what God asks us to do. The church, both local congregation and (inter)national organisation, exists to to serve the purposes of God’s kingdom. Having said that, God’s work is not confined to the church and neither is a pastor’s calling.
I made wedding vows in God’s sight before I was ordained. Who has first claim on me, my wife or the church? Neither: God has. I know this is not easy in practice, but I practice (and preach) that the family birthday may take precedence over the church meeting – for the sake of both the two great commandments.
As for pastors needing pastors – I think that is why Jesus sent his disciples out in twos and had at least eleven apostles (leaders) in his first church.
God bless
you
Yes, yes, YES!!! I agree with this article and most definitely with your added comment here, kangerew. My husband and I are on a team of pastors in a church and our lead pastor (by his expectations) seems to equate God’s work with church work, and chides you if you act otherwise.
This is a very broad comment that really requires much more than a blog comment to discuss, but I concur with Mr. Zens. The current model of a single pastor for hundreds of people isn’t particularly biblical. It’s a standard organization model for businesses and other entities, but not very effective for discipling people on the deep level the Christ exemplified. I have friends who are pastors over churches that range from a few hundred to a few thousand and I have seen the frustration and trials you speak of. Almost all of it springs from being performance driven- which is perfectly logical when you feel on display as much as a church pastor in the current model is… But it isn’t how it has to be- or should be. This is not judgement- I’ve been there. I’m suggesting there is a better way.
Again this is bigger than a comment. Take a look at some things from a friend, Sam Soleyn. The Holy Spirit turned the lights on for me concerning these things when I met Sam. Samsoleyn.com
Always happy to discuss further if you’d like to email as well.
I applaud your desire to father.
The answer to all these reason is that if your in it for glory, appreciation,applause or even money your in for wrong reasons ministry is about serving. Christ came not only to redeem us from sin but to serve a people who he knew would spit,backstab, and deny they knew him. But his objective was to serve why here on this 1 If there be therefore any consolation in Christ, if any comfort of love, if any fellowship of the Spirit, if any bowels and mercies, 2 Fulfil ye my joy, that ye be likeminded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind. 3 Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves. 4 Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others.
5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:7 But made himself of no reputation, took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: 8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. 9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; 11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. (KJV) so remember Jesus knew all who would walk away and who would stay just as he knows who leaves your flock but remember in all things serve just as he did and you shall receive your crown at his coming and be glad to hear well done thou good and faithful servant.
Stanley, you said, “The answer to all these reason is that if your in it for glory, appreciation,applause or even money your in for wrong reasons ministry is about serving.”
That isn’t applicable to just pastors. This bit of truth that you shared is for ALL those who seek to live as citizens of the kingdom. I’m not sure how it is that you feed your family, Stanely, but whatever it is that you do, I hope you aren’t doing it for “glory, appreciation,applause or even money” because if so, well, then your in it for the wrong reasons. As a Christian, all of us are called into a ministry of serving. Some serve in the church, and some serve outside the church, but all are ministers of the gospel called to serve in the name of and on behalf of Jesus Christ. Still, I admit, it is nice at the end of the day to hear well-done from both Jesus Christ and maybe even a few others who share the same vision as he?
Amen…..
Love the article! The part in #7, giving the finger, made me giggle. As the wife of a pastor, that has crossed my mind–hey, no judgement. Thank you for putting it all out there. 🙂
Reblogged this on Into the blue… and commented:
As a retired pastor who has had a lot of opportunity to reflect on the experience of being in parish ministry, I say a loud “Amen!” to this. The truth is that many clergy live out these things every day. Thanks to Pastor Matt for this.
While I don’t want to imply that what you’re feeling is wrong, it does frustrate the congregation that the pastor takes it personally when we leave, too.
We have several children. Before kids, we commuted to church. After kids, though, the commute was so long for them. In addition, our church didn’t have a children’s ministry.
We feel very strongly that our kids should be involved in church from a young age. So, what is a parent to do? Start a kids ministry with only their children?
For us, the answer was clear: we needed to switch churches to one where our entire family could not only be involved, but be completely immersed in the church family.
Unfortunately, our pastor didn’t understand. He still isn’t speaking to us. While I understand it hurts, I really wish more pastors were able to not take it personally. If switching to a church makes someone feel more comfortable and that gets them in where they will truly hear the message, so be it!
I just wanted to point that out for any pastors who might be reading this. It truly is NOT personal in such a situation. We still love and respect our old pastor, despite his anger with us now. And chances are, those who leave your church love and respect you, too. 🙂
I understand your frustration, but I also understand where your Pastor is coming from (not that I would stop speaking to someone over this). In all of the churches that I have served in, we have struggled to put a Children’s Ministry together. In each, the biggest obstacle was that we had nothing to start with. Every time you get a family coming through visiting, they would say, “We love your church, but we need something for our kids.” It’s a vicious cycle: you can’t start a Children’s Ministry without children, but you can’t get children unless you already have a Children’s Ministry in place.
“So, what is a parent to do? Start a kids ministry with only their children?”
Thats basically what we have had to do where we are now. Our kids and one other family that wasn’t bothered by the lack of numbers were the seeds, and our children’s ministry has finally started to grow (along with the young adult part of the church). This has enabled us to reach out effectively to other families with kids.
I understand that, And had it been not such a long commute, we may have made a different decision.
That being said, I’d be interested which is biblically more important – bringing up your children in the most Christ centered way possible or growing a church for others. I’m honestly not sure of that and would be open to suggested reading.
” which is biblically more important – bringing up your children in the most Christ centered way possible or growing a church for others. ”
This is not an either/or question: you can (and should) do both. A small program, with teachers that can give a lot of attention to individual kids could be very effective, but too many parents do not realize that. Also, in the Bible, it was the responsibility primarily of the parents (not the synagogue or the church) to teach the kids about God and right/wrong.
Don’t get me wrong, I am NOT criticizing your decision to leave, merely pointing out one aspect of the equation that needs to be considered. My original point was that your former Pastor, though he may not be reacting as he should, is not unreasonable in expressing frustrations with this.
What should you do? Start a children’s ministry with just your children? Uhhhh….i guess it depends on two very important criteria……1. Were you just wanting to attend a church and have someone do all the work for you? Or do you want to be the church, rolling up your sleeves and put your hand to the plow to grow the church? Adding to “the church daily is in large part the focal point of the early new testament church and it is my belief that the roll of the early church pastor was designed to train the church to do the work of the ministry. It was the apostle Paul who taught that it wasn’t right for the pastor to be dealing with the daily administration of the church but rather to be given to the study of the word and prayer…2. We’re you part of the church family or not? If you weren’t then you should have NEVER allowed your former pastor to build a relationship with you. If you could understand how the pastor feels about you then you would NEVER tell pastors not to take it personally when you leave. We cry with you, pray with and for you….watch as your children grow and left our own children at home with our spouse to come pray with yours at 3am because little Tommy was running a 103 degree fever. Your admonition to pastors to not take it personally is due in large part to a lack of understanding and I’m not trying to be hard on you because I understand. You must realize however that it will always be personal for any pastor who has served you to find out you’re going down the street because they have a better program for your children instead of helping to grow one where you are….After all….He thought you were serving together and discovered that those who leave are really interested in being served rather than serving. I’m not saying it was this way in your case but generally speaking that’s how a pastor feels when you leave.
WOW!!! I am a new pastor of a church that went through the fire and a big split right before I got here. Everyone single one of those apply to me except for number nine. Other than that, everything was spot on.
I have a pretty good idea that my comments will upset a lot of folks on all sides of the church. I don’t think that is my intention… but…
As I recall the ministry of Jesus as represented in the Gospels, and as I try to observe that ministry from as many angles as my limited mind and heart will allow, I am struck by the paucity, the teeny tiny, the relative small amount of time that the Bible indicates that Jesus spent in formal, organized, localized worship… or preaching… or moderating governing boards… or sitting down with other Rabbii’s… or trying to explain to some of his followers why some others no longer followed.
In fact, as I try as best I can to look at in an impartial manner, it seems to me that the ministry of Jesus bears very little resemblance to modern clergy duties. Oh, granted, the modern pastor does some of the same things that Jesus did, but the modern pastor does them differently. And that “differently” makes things perplexing.
It leads me to ask the questions… What group more closely follows the texture, feel, practice (however badly or well) the actual ministerial practice of Jesus… the professional clergy, or the laity? To me the answer is… the laity.
Well, then…. who most closely resembles the practice of today’s professional clergy? ……. sigh …….. the Pharisees.
Now, please put your tar and feathers asside for a moment. And instead of dwelling of just how wrong you think I am, spend just a few moments discovering the truth in my statement. I am not talking about intent here, I am talking about practice. In many ways, modern Christianity would be better served if there were no pastors, no church buildings, no committees, no governing bodies, no denominations, no cathedrals, no Pope, no organization.
There is much, much more that could be said on this, but much of today’s organized religion is not at all as Jesus exemplified for us. And it has established a class structure where there is to be none. And both the clergy and the laity suffer for it.
Oh, BTW, I am very well educated holding degrees in engineering, social sciences, and the ministry, have served in industry in manufacturing, fabrication, engineering, sales, and project leadership, have been ordained in a mainline reformed denomination, and served as solo pastor for several churches…. <– all of which means precisely squat. (If you don't get it, I am laughing at myself).
The paradox that clergy must live with is the same that Jesus lived with: To do God's work requires that you be vulnerable. Being vulnerable means you will be hurt. And you are to love those who hurt you.
Still, Pastor Matt (PastorBoz) pretty much nails the feelings that go with the position. …………from another Pastor Matt
Brave. I think you have a hard calling, some of which is general with leadership in almost any vocation, but pastor has the extra added specialness of trying to be separate from the world while being part of the world. I don’t hear that kind of honestly a lot, so thank you for sharing.
Ouch. Right on.
I COULD LEAVE ALOT IN MY ‘REPLY’. I LOVE THE LORD, BUT HIS PEOPLE ARE VERY DISCOURAGING. WE SERVE A WOUNDED AND DISCOURAGED GROUP OF PEOPLE. YOU’RE RIGHT, WE HAVE NO PASTOR OR ENCOURAGER WE CAN REALLY LET OUR HEART OUT WITH. THE CHURCH BEFORE THE ONE WE CURRENTLY SERVE….THREATENED OUR LIVES THREE TIMES. WE WERE TREATED LIKE TRASH….WE WERE LIED ABOUT….AND I COULD GO ON AND ON….ALL IN ‘THE NAME OF THE LORD’. WE WERE THE NINTH ‘PASTOR’ THIS HAD BEEN DONE TO AND THERE HAS SINCE BEEN ONE AFTER US WHO HAS ALREADY LEFT….AND THE CHURCH IS AGAIN ‘ON THE SEARCH’. IF THEY WOULD HIRE, UP FRONT AND SAY THEY WILL JUST KEEP YOU FOR TWO YEARS AND THEN ONTO THE NEXT HONEYMOON, FEWER PASTORS WOULD GET WOUNDED FOR LIFE. TALK ABOUT PTSD! I WISH THIS WERE THE EXCEPTION. SADLY, IT IS NOT. IT’S A SAD DA WE LIVE IN FOR SURE!
Reblogged this on JimErwin.com and commented:
I have felt these feelings at one time or another. The article rings true.
I can honestly say that those same 10 things are true for those of us who are mental health therapists!
wow- I’ve been a pastor for 12+ years- I completely disagree with 9 of your 10 points. I’m a little bit discouraged that you’d speak for pastors and be so off the mark…
Thank you for posting this and for being real. I truly appreciate it. It’s given me much food for thought concerning the tough job God’s shepherds face. God bless!!
I’ve pastored for over 30 years and now work with pastors in a consulting/coaching role.
Your post is so helpful with its raw honesty. You’ve pulled back the veil on what a lot of pastors feel and experience which I think is incredibly helpful.
Maybe denominations need to do more to pastor their pastors so that they can cope better with the complexities of pastoring today.
Huge thanks for posting this.
I read this after just finishing my first evangelistic outreach event as the teaching pastor tonight, (and having seen my church shrink by half over the last year). Hundreds came and went throughout the night tonight–huge success in that regard, but when I spoke, NO ONE came up for the altar call. (Note to my brethren who will want to tell me all the ways I’m looking at this wrong and it was God’s event, not mine, etc.: Yeah, I know. I went to school and read that part of the Bible too.)
After the event, I looked around and said, God showed up, the people showed up, my congregation showed up to serve; no one accepted Jesus. Obvious conclusion: The problem is me. Not hard hearts, not resistance to change. Every evangelist I know has those same kind of people and yet the guy down the street has ’em coming up to the altar on charter buses. So I must be the pig at the princess party here. And then I just beat myself up for thinking about me at all.
What a relief to read this blog entry at this time. To the pastor who wrote so articulately the things I fight inside my head: You have spoken words of life to my ailing heart. All my stupid feelings of envy and failure and self-doubt aren’t just me! Thank you for writing this to let those of us who battle our failings so fiercely and who are so hard on ourselves know that we’re not alone in these struggles.
If anyone read this article and thought less of your pastor, I want you to know that these things are only true of us because we are so wholly committed to the ministry. Teaching the Word of God is like breathing oxygen for us. We want nothing more in this world than for the people God has loaned to us to find salvation, purpose, and a deep and abiding relationship with Him. But we are human; and frail and fearful and fallible as that title entails.
I hope eyes are opened by this blog and that it shows you how much we need and value your prayers, your encouragement, and your holding up our hands as our co-laborers. We are ordinary men serving an extraordinary God. Believe me when I tell you, it’s usually enough just to have someone making sure there’s a bottle of water under the pulpit before church starts. (Before you reply that pastors aren’t too important to get their own water, 1. We often forget to take care of ourselves when we’re taking care of the congregation. 2. See “Yeah, I know” above. 3. See Matthew 10:42.)
Thank you again, brother, for an uplifting and bold statement of the heart.
We are all priests, so then, what is this employed titled office of “Pastor” anyway? How is that Christ in one person (who has been given a title) greater than Christ in another person (without a title of office or authority) in the body of Christ, which is the priesthood of all believers? How then is it that we wonder how these persons of title are overburdened? They have to be the whole body instead of just one part of the body, or so they have to be the whole priesthood instead of just one priest in the priesthood.
Thank you for writing this blog. I have been questioning my calling, and this blog affirms it is okay to be frustrated but to keep going. The good news needs to reach at least one person.
I believe it is only Reformed theology that can provide a consistent basis for faithfulness in ministry. When the message of God’s sovereign grace is set aside, human ability is elevated, and man centred ideas of church growth are promoted. Pastoral ministry is difficult in any circumstance, but the best arsenal in the pastor’s possession is a biblical view of God and of man, and that means Calvinism.
wait – *laughter* – wait a second – – – Ok, I’ve picked myself off the floor from laughter – – – Let’s ask ol’ Mark Driscoll about calvinism and church growth shall we? Not sure that church growth and any other view but Calvinism in Christianity go hand in hand.
Reblogged this on Frank's Five Cents and commented:
This guy jumped right into my brain, except about the 520 cause I don’t know where that is.
Reblogged this on Chris Aiken and commented:
Here is a thought provoking post on ministry life. I can identify with many of these…many more than I care to. It is a good read…
I am not the pastor I am a pastor’s wife. I have observed these pressures in ministry and sensed/experienced some in our own ministerial existence. I appreciate your candor (this is why we like working with you!). Thank you for being transparent rather than opaque.